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 aggressive behaviour help

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babypink
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Thu 24 Dec 2009, 6:23 pm

Oh I swapped to rubber matting and shavings, so much better and cleaner. But on very cold nihts I did use straw and matting, put down loads of straw, and just picked out the wet stuff and droppings and at the end of the week the whole lot came out and then started again it was so quick to do

Thankfully I now have my boy on full livery, too much working full time, DIY livery and all that, was knackered most days - lol
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Mattie
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Thu 24 Dec 2009, 6:38 pm

Were do you have him at livery? I used to work at Bankhouse Farm, Middlestown and Silkstone Equestrian Centre near Barnsley. I have seen many places but none came up to the standard of Bankhouse Farm.
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kirstie
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Mon 01 Feb 2010, 5:31 pm

we have a similar problem with our staffy dog Tyne. we try and get people to let us know when they coming round so we lock him up out the way then when he settles he gets let out.
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tracy barry
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Tue 02 Feb 2010, 10:37 pm

hi kirstie thats what i did and it worked for me keep it up hun and see what happens goog luck. xx
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kirstie
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Wed 03 Feb 2010, 10:52 am

tracy thats just the start of what we do lol if they come round unexpected we have to gently get him by the collar n literally pull him in2 another room as he really kicks off n tries to bite us aswell. i dont show him any fear now so he doesnt do it as bad now but i find its a long struggle but you do slowly find that you get somewhere. a few months ago my partner and me were thinking about getting him put to sleep as he was getting out of control and becoming a danger but now we are thinking more positive. also i have had a word with a dog trainer for help and we are enroled in a training class aswell, maybe try that in your area hun, asking cant do any wrong can it. hope this helps
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kirstie
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Wed 03 Feb 2010, 10:54 am

i must also say that we havent had Tyne since being a pup, we got him at 9/10 month old so wether this has added to his behaviour i dont know but we are slowly getting there
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Mattie
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Wed 03 Feb 2010, 12:02 pm

Kirsty you will be better having a short lead on him when you are in the house so you can use the lead to get him into another room. This is much safer than using the collar as he can bite you.

If you really want him to be comfortable with people it can be done but takes a lot of work and some very willing friends who will do what you tell them to do.
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frejusman
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Wed 03 Feb 2010, 11:48 pm

Tracy Barry
first of all how does she attack him is it very agressive or just having a bite on the cheek and pining him down?
Mick
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tracy barry
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Wed 03 Feb 2010, 11:57 pm

hi mick it was agressive.
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frejusman
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Thu 04 Feb 2010, 12:16 am

How old is she?
How long as this been going on for?
Does this turn into a full fight or just in small sperts
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frejusman
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Thu 04 Feb 2010, 12:22 am

I will tell you why I am asking as Chandler the male daddy dog he has always put his foot down when anyone is causing a noise he goes in like a sack of taters (potatos) and pins the noisey dog down. When a he as had enough he's had enough.
But also there is the female version I have the female been agresive when she is about to come on heat.
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Mattie
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Thu 04 Feb 2010, 9:46 am

kirstie wrote:
i must also say that we havent had Tyne since being a pup, we got him at 9/10 month old so wether this has added to his behaviour i dont know but we are slowly getting there

Kirsty, is Tyne neutered, if so how old was he?
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tracy barry
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Thu 04 Feb 2010, 4:19 pm

hi mick she is the youngest at 17 months. it was only when the male barked she use to attack he, at first she use to nip him then one day we could not get her of she sank her teeth in him.
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kirstie
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Thu 04 Feb 2010, 8:12 pm

hi mattie no he isnt neutered yet, ive got him enroled in a dog class which starts on the 26th of feb he was suposed to go in jan but i wasnt well enough to take him so was postponed. i have seen a lot of improvement since my post of behaviour help. he is much calmer but he still has his moments! ive tried a short lead on him n he just ends up chewing it and tends to make him more aggrivated than anything but im willing to try anything. his exercise has increased and he seems to be calmer. hes been vet checked and is fine so i think hes just trying to push his luck. he wasnt socalised wen we got him at all and he is now able to play with the dog next door nicely aswel as our others. i just hope that the classes im going to take him to will help 1 way or another. it's been a long road so far and have thought about giving up on him a few times but then i see the nice loving side of him which is showing more and more as he was all for the hubby and wouldnt sit with me. now hes always wanting cuddles and even now and again gives me a lick and also he has to be near me most of the time. i'm being careful with him as my demi is due in heat around march so im not going to let myself get ahead of myself as i know that males change when theres a bitch in heat
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Mattie
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Thu 04 Feb 2010, 8:46 pm

kirstie wrote:
hi mattie no he isnt neutered yet,

There is an injection the vet can give, sorry can’t remember what it is called, that may tell you if he will change if you have him neutered, sometimes neutering helps, sometimes it doesn’t, sometimes it makes a problem worse so may be worth trying this.

Quote :
ive got him enroled in a dog class which starts on the 26th of feb he was suposed to go in jan but i wasnt well enough to take him so was postponed.

Dog classes may or may not help, I hope they do but be prepared to pull him out if they don’t, if you keep him in when he is reacting it will make him worse. Eventually with work you may be able to go back.

Quote :
i have seen a lot of improvement since my post of behaviour help. he is much calmer but he still has his moments!

All down to your hard work, well done, keep it up and he will continue to improve.

Quote :
ive tried a short lead on him n he just ends up chewing it and tends to make him more aggrivated than anything but im willing to try anything.

Use a chain lead if you need him on a short lead, he can’t chew through that. This is common with Staffies, they chew leads.

Quote :
his exercise has increased and he seems to be calmer.

Good, increasing exercise often does help.

Quote :
hes been vet checked and is fine so i think hes just trying to push his luck. he wasnt socalised wen we got him at all and he is now able to play with the dog next door nicely aswel as our others.

No he isn’t pushing his luck, he hasn’t learnt how to behave but is learning now, you have already got him playing with another dog so well done, that takes some doing. The best way to get a dog like him to accept other dogs is to keep him at a distance were he doesn’t react when he sees a dog. He needs to see dogs but at a distance he is comfortable with. You will find that this distance will get shorter and shorter.

Also nice things happen when he sees another dog, very high reward treats or a special toy, these are to be used for this only and nothing else to keep them very high reward. I tried quite a few different ways with Gracie and this is the only way that worked, she because a wonderful dog with other dogs and is now being more and more acceptable to retrain dog aggressive dogs. Victoria Stillwell uses a similar method with these dogs.

Quote :
i just hope that the classes im going to take him to will help 1 way or another.

He may not be ready for classes yet, many dogs like him shut down in classes and trainers and owners think the dog is being good, eventually this makes the problem worse because the dog has been flooded when terrified.

Think of it this way, if you were frightened of spiders and someone put you in a room full of them, what would your reaction be? While dogs are not people, they do have similar feelings especially with fear.

Quote :
Its been a long road so far and have thought about giving up on him a few times but then i see the nice loving side of him which is showing more and more as he was all for the hubby and wouldnt sit with me. now hes always wanting cuddles and even now and again gives me a lick and also he has to be near me most of the time. i'm being careful with him as my demi is due in heat around march so im not going to let myself get ahead of myself as i know that males change when theres a bitch in heat

It is a long road but when your dog improves it is worth it. Keep a diary of him so you can look back and see just how much he has improved, it does help when things are going wrong. He will teach you a lot about dog aggression, it is how I learnt about it. I will help as much as I can, but only you can turn this dog round.
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kirstie
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Thu 04 Feb 2010, 9:00 pm

thanks mattie. i apreciate any advice as im sure tracy does, sorry tracy for taking over your post! i had a word about tyne to the trainer of the classes before i enroled him and she also offers 1 2 1 house calls and said that if i have to remove him from the classes then this option is available. if it was up to my hubby then the dog would have been gone long ago, i honestly dont no where i get the patients from. i guess i just think if i can keep a rottweiler under control in a strained situation as at 1 time he wasnt very good with other dogs but i turned him around then theres hope 4 tyne. to be honest i really dont see what im doing different with him that i havent been doing b4 unless he's settling a bit more and realises that he's here to stay. i never thought of using a chain lead! i'll keep my eye open for a really short 1 that can be on him during the day. it's amazing how each dog is different and teach us different things! i also think that the classes will help me to keep him from pulling on the lead as seeing it in action is different from reading the text. im feeling confident that he will be ok in them as not so long ago id av said no way am i taking him but now he seems more tolerant and there wont be that many there and it will be controled area. if he will not settle or seems agitated then i will remove him as like u say it'l do more harm than good and isnt fair on tyne himself. at the end of the day it's his welfare that is important aswel as the other dogs safety.
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Jo n Buffs
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Thu 04 Feb 2010, 9:08 pm

the injection sounds brill advice mattie ive never heard of that before with never owning a dog but i will keep that one in mind if and when we do decide to have another pup :D
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tracy barry
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Thu 04 Feb 2010, 10:39 pm

hi kirstie dont worry it nice to get advice anything what helps. it sounds like your doing well.mattie has adviced you and she is good she help me with my little one only she was very fearful to be honest i think staffies should be socialised from an early age which i did with my other 2 dogs had no problems. i started taking saffie to training classes and mattie said it might be that she could not cope with it so i pulled her out.i will try again maybe later in the year. it works for some and not other but i would try it see if it works for you. it did for me going to crufts it march doing obedience. it will need a lot of patience and understanding and i wish you all the luck you can do it hun. xxx
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Mattie
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Fri 05 Feb 2010, 11:37 am

Like children dogs need to feel safe, when they are reacting they don't feel safe, this is an article I wrote about dog aggression, it may help you understand aggression and why your dog is reacting the way he is.

Please do not pass this on to anywhere else, it is for the eyes only of the members on here and my own forum.

Understanding Dog Aggression

Many of the problems I am seeing on the internet is aggression, this isn’t just confined to Staffies but is right across the breeds.

There are many reasons why a dog may act aggressively, for any sudden aggression in a dog that hasn’t shown it before, it is important that you have a full vet check-up first. Health problems do cause a lot of aggress depending on what is wrong with your dog.

Pain often causes aggression in dogs as well as several health problems including thyroid problems which is often over looked. If your dog suddenly becomes aggressive and your vet can’t find out what is wrong, ask for a full thyroid test. There are 2 tests, most vets just do a simple one but that doesn’t always show up problems, it is better to go straight to the bigger test.

Some problems with pain that can cause aggression is sore ears, toothache, sprains, lost a nail etc.

Many dogs become grumpy as they get older, this is normal, they don’t like being woken up by being touched so will bite, some dogs never like being woken up by touch and will bite right from being pups. I don’t like being woken up like this either and I will bite. Many people think dogs should accept this, but why should they? I always make a noise to wake my dogs up, I never touch them.
.
Fear aggression is one of the most common problems why people ask for advice,. There are many reasons for this but the main ones are:

1.The dog has not had enough social interactions with other dogs and learnt how to communicate properly with other dogs
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2. Has been attacked by another.

A fear aggressive dog is often made worse by the dog being on a lead or cornered, the dog will usually go into fight, flight or freeze. Owners don’t recognise their dog is in freeze and will continue to pull the dog away and wonder why the dog can’t/wont move.

A dog can’t go into flight when on a lead, some dogs may try at first and try to hide behind the owner who then pulls the dog out and tell the dog not to be so stupid or tries to reassure the dog which then reinforces to the dog that he was right to be frightened.

As the dog hasn’t been able to freeze or flight he goes into fight mode, to him this is his only option so he tries to frighten the other dog away by barking and/or growling, his hackles will come up and he will try and make himself bigger, some dogs, usually Collies, will go down, when this doesn’t work he will try to attack the other dog to chase him away. Most owners will then respond by shortening the lead to pull the dog away which will reinforce to the dog that being aggressive works, his owner pulls him away from the dog he is so frightened of. Again many owners will try to reassure the dog or scold him for his behaviour which gives attention to all this and makes it all a lot worse.

Each time this happens we are reinforcing the aggressive behaviour, you are Classically Conditioning your dog and each time it happens it will get worse. Your dog has learnt that showing aggression works.

Many people shout or hit their dogs when they do this, again this will make the problem worse because the owner is reinforcing to the dog that there is something to be frightened of. The dog will pick up the owner’s fear and think he is frightened of the same thing but the owner’s fear is making this worse by the way they are reacting.

Chase or Predatory aggression

This one is usually worse when the dog is exercised off the lead rather than on it.

It will chase another dog that can by quite some distance away, ignoring any attempts by the owner to stop. Typically the dog is usually quite well trained and responsive when other dogs are not around. The behaviour of the chased dog will often determine the outcome.

This type of dog behaves exactly the same no matter who takes it out for the walk. It enjoys the chase and most dogs will chase anything that moves, cats, joggers etc. Owners will throw balls etc for their dog to chase thinking this is what the dog needs, instead it switches the “On” button for chasing. These type of dogs need an “Off” button, this means that the owner can stop the dog in the middle of the chase, very few can.

If you have an aggressive dog:

1. There is no magic cure, many will tell you there is and many will use gadgets like shock collars but the only sure way is a lot of hard, consistent work.

2. A visit to your vet should always be the first step in helping both you and your dog overcome this problem before it gets worse. In case it is a heal problem.

3. Dogs do not grow out of it - you need good positive experiences to teach your dog to overcome these and move forward to a good happy dog.
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tracy barry
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Fri 05 Feb 2010, 3:28 pm

hi mattie, yes that is so true about thyroid problems are often over looked. my friend had a dog who had muscle wastage on his face around the jaw and the eyes test came back with somethink called eosinophilic myasitis and that was an underactive thyroid. a full thyroid test is t3,t4.
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kirstie
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Fri 05 Feb 2010, 3:32 pm

thanks mattie. i must admit i used to shout and sometimes scream at tyne but now i just say nothing to him at all i just turn away and begin walking in another direction. he usually follows as i have a 6ft training lead 4 him now so he has more freedom and once it gets 2 the length he has no choice but to follow lol. at 1 time i wouldnt feel as calm and collected and be able to do this i used to panic and i think tyne used to pick up on it and play even more towards whatever was causing the problem. now i try to look for signs in him i.e. stiffening whilst walking, tail and ears pricked up and slower walking and i try to get his attention on me rather than whatever he sees. which can be like gettin blood out of a stone but i make him sit and wait until he does look at me instead of the dog etc. its hard work and very repetative i hope im doing right here mattie
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Mattie
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Fri 05 Feb 2010, 4:18 pm

Yes the calmer you are the better, got some work for you to do, look and study these clips, they are about a dog's body language and will help you learn to read Tyne. It is a lecture given by Jean Donaldson and well worth watching, I learnt a lot from them.





Dog's Body Language Part 1

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=0VmWizZueFQ

Part 2

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Jw6ONwp-42A&NR=1

Part 3

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=9loVtVheexY&NR=1

Part 4

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=PT4hLYdd5HY&NR=1

Part 5

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=M-VNVvmjb6c&feature=related

Part 6

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Rj_8ehodBmQ&feature=related

Part 7

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=B_5J5fAyFmo&feature=related
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kirstie
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PostSubject: Re: aggressive behaviour help   Fri 05 Feb 2010, 4:35 pm

thankyou mattie ive book marked them and will defo have a look
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