Staffiezone

Members: Please Log In

As a guest you will only be able to read the main topics from the forum.

Register to see loads more sections and join in the fun.

We are a friendly bunch of pet lovers mainly consisting of Staffies and Bullies, but all dogs and owners are welcome and many of us have other dogs and pets that we talk about, plus general chit chat, competitions and entertainment.

It is free to register, free to chat and you will not be asked for money to continue being a member once you have joined.

So pull up a chair and join our small community on the internet.





 
HomeFrontLog inChat BoxRegister

Share | 
 

 Bonding and trust

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
Go to page : 1, 2  Next
AuthorMessage
Namadaja
Addicted Member
Addicted Member
avatar

Female
Location : Wiltshire
Number of posts : 118

PostSubject: Bonding and trust   Thu 22 Mar 2012, 1:43 pm

My other half thinks I am over thinking things, he is often right!

I'm worried about my bond with Rosy, sometimes she is in tune with me, like when walking she usually checks in with me as we walk. But then other times its like she has switched off. I will call her and she will just stare at me and then ignore me. Or she will get half way and then change her mind, but she always looks like she is going to be in trouble for doing it! I'm not sure what to do to build on the bond that we do have. I give her lots of praise, I don't believe in giving a smack so I usually use AH! if she is doing something that she shouldn't be.

Brings me on to trust. Rosy has no recall so I don't let her off lead. She just will not return if called when out. I am scared she will run. Am I making it worse because she can tell I don't trust her to come back? Hubby thinks I need to bite the bullet and just do it.

I have just realised how personally I am taking all this lol, I really do feel like I am lacking!! Doesn't help that she refused to eat all her food last night and this morning so I'm also worrying about that, she usually woolfs her food down.
Back to top Go down
suziet
Team Support
Team Support
avatar

Female
Location : East Riding of Yorkshire
Number of posts : 23424

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Thu 22 Mar 2012, 1:56 pm

Hi Hun

upon reading your post I can tell how much you love Rosy and want to do what's best for her too - I do feel you maybe over thinking a little - as far as recall is concerned we have all been here and at times my boys totally ignore me lol xx

Long Lines are a fantastic tool for recall but you need an extra special treat to enable Rosy to find you and the recall worth coming back for - I always found hot dogs were fab for recall xx

Also as Rosy is now settling into your family rountine she will begin to try and find her own paws aronud the home and like a new puppy to the home will test boundaries like any doggie would.

Try recall in the garden to the home for example - start from home and then go onto a field with a long line - as you begin to find trust and Rosy knows what to expect with the recall it should all start to come together xx

Rosy maybe picking up on your anxious state and therefore isnt eating - just try to relax - Staffords are VERY sensitive to our moods and emotions and they know when something is on our mind xx

You're not alone on this one xx

Back to top Go down
Alliecass
VIP Forum Member
VIP Forum Member


Female
Location : Wales
Number of posts : 6762

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Thu 22 Mar 2012, 2:07 pm

Great advice from Suzie, cassie can have selective hearing lol, but I have a plastic pot with her favourite treats in it, so when she turns round too look at me as if say shall I shant I, I shake the pot and she comes running, then lots of praise for her.

also dont worry too much about an off day with her food, cassie has these too group hug

also perhaps find a training class and go along, I have found that has enabled cassie and me to have a good bond, as she loves training xx

Back to top Go down
suziet
Team Support
Team Support
avatar

Female
Location : East Riding of Yorkshire
Number of posts : 23424

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Thu 22 Mar 2012, 3:18 pm

Training Classes are a superb idea xxx My boys and I loved training and you learn so much too - xx
Back to top Go down
Namadaja
Addicted Member
Addicted Member
avatar

Female
Location : Wiltshire
Number of posts : 118

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Thu 22 Mar 2012, 6:27 pm

Holy heck, just got home to find Rosy has been going mental and is sat in amongst the remains of her bed which she has shredded. I think its a good idea I am going out tonight because I think I'm going to cry :'(
Back to top Go down
Namadaja
Addicted Member
Addicted Member
avatar

Female
Location : Wiltshire
Number of posts : 118

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Thu 22 Mar 2012, 6:29 pm

Actually, scrap that, too late for going to cry.

She stopped shredding when we came in and because we didn't immediately go to her she started again. Desperately digging and tearing at the remains of the bed.
Back to top Go down
tifla
Gold Forum Member
Gold Forum Member
avatar

Female
Location : North Yorkshire
Number of posts : 635

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Thu 22 Mar 2012, 6:39 pm

I think that you probably are over-thinking this.

We took on Bertie in September 2011 & all we really know is that the vet guessed he was between 6 - 8 months. Bonding with Bertie seemed really quick & easy - but I don't think that had anything to do with us, so much as the fact that after just being abandoned on the beach & then going through at least 4 homes in really quick succession before he came to us, he was just desperate for love & affection.

Bertie had been with us about 6 or 7 weeks when he had to stay with Steve's sister for a few days because, due to previous arrangements, Steve & I went to Brighton for a few days & his dad had to go to Nottingham. When Steve & I got home his sister dropped Bertie off with us & the poor dog was hysterical –shaking really badly, piddling all over the place & making incredibly strange noises. His basket had gone with him to Steve's sister's house but as soon as we put it down in our bedroom the poor boy got in & peed all over it.

We felt so guilty for leaving him.

But Steve & I never had any qualms about letting him off the lead. His dad has never had a dog before, but it was just obvious to Steve & me that Bertie would do anything not to lose us.

I think practising recall on a long lead till you feel really confident that Rosy comes back will make you feel more positive about letting her off. I suspect Rosy loves & trusts you, it's just that so much other stuff is just so, so exciting. Bertie clearly forgets about us sometimes & frequently looks like we're going to beat him to death when he returns to us - at other times he returns to us like he hasn't seen us for weeks - actually it's been 3 or 4 minutes while he's been charging up & down the beach with another dog.

He was very destructive to begin with when he was left alone – he dug up the hall carpet, learned how to open the kitchen door & stole anything he could find, he ate the sleeves of Steve’s dad’s best jacket… I could go on & on & on.

He really is getting much better – although he still hates being left on his own & even at the age of 12 - 14 months he often poos is left for over an hour - but this is getting less frequent.

I know how upsetting & frustrating it is!

I am sure Rosy loves you.

Her behaviour is no reflection of that, it just takes time – which is no consolation when you’re tidying up that mess…

Sorry if this doesn't make great sense - I'm still at work cos it's Parents' Evening & I am doing this between appointments.
Back to top Go down
Namadaja
Addicted Member
Addicted Member
avatar

Female
Location : Wiltshire
Number of posts : 118

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Thu 22 Mar 2012, 6:54 pm

Thank you. I just don't understand why she would start being destructive after being ok for the last 4 weeks? I don't know whats happened so I feel like I can't put it right. I'm probably too emotional to put anything right at the mo, I just let her into the garden and dealt with the bed. She has made herself bleed where she has been chewing the crate bars. Her adaptil collar has just run out and I ordered her new one today but the diffuser is still half full and right by her bed so I don't think its because thats run out.

I took her to visit the kennels for her holiday in august....she was really excited about being there, had a mooch round, lots of snuffling, had a wee and was generally ok with it all....but even though she was excited could it have set her off again??? And if it was the kennels then what the heck do I do for august? Will I have any hair left by then!?
Back to top Go down
tifla
Gold Forum Member
Gold Forum Member
avatar

Female
Location : North Yorkshire
Number of posts : 635

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Thu 22 Mar 2012, 7:03 pm

In all honesty, we are slightly baffled as to why Bertie has peed in the house 4 times (that we know of) & pooed twice in the last week?

He has injured himself a few times - he cut his mouth when he tried to eat a glass pie dish! Why!???

I think you have to give kennels a chance & please try to look forward to your holiday - try not to get stressed about a holiday - which is supposed to relax you & make you feel better.
Back to top Go down
Staffylover
Team Member
Team Member
avatar

Female
Location : Cheshire
Number of posts : 31891

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Thu 22 Mar 2012, 7:23 pm

Michelle

You are being far too hard on yourself, you are doing a brilliant job with Rosy, you need to try and relax and enjoy her.

Training classes are a good way to bond and also to help her socialise too.

I would use the long lead with her for now and try very nice treats that are only used for recall, you could consider training her with a whistle for recall so you always know she can hear you.

All dogs have an off day or a bad day just like we do, it does not mean they are unhappy or you are doing a bad job with them. She is only very young and is still finding her place within your family xx

_________________

Back to top Go down
wids
VIP Forum Member
VIP Forum Member


Female
Location : east anglia
Number of posts : 11372

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Thu 22 Mar 2012, 7:30 pm

We all understand how frustrating it is when they do this sort of thing - believe me we've been through a few ruined wrecked and eaten beds over the years. lol!

Just a couple of thoughts but

Was she exercised before you left her - a tired dog does less bed wrecking. If you get her tired before you go out she will gradually get used to it as a rest time.

Does she have anything to occupy her in the crate like a stuffed kong.

Do you make a big fuss when you go out saying goodbye. Comforting them when you go out can make too big a thing out of going out.

Back to top Go down
Namadaja
Addicted Member
Addicted Member
avatar

Female
Location : Wiltshire
Number of posts : 118

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Thu 22 Mar 2012, 10:03 pm

Thanks all. She is normally fine when we go out, she goes into her crate, I shut the door and leave with zero fuss and never go back to comfort. If I know it will be an hour or so then we go for a walk before so that she is tired. I leave her with her stuff bone thing. Today we had been out and about before leaving her, went to pet shop then took her up to school and then home. My mum thinks that although she seemed fine at the kennels it has knocked her as she is being clingy this evening. Just rang and checked on her and mum said she is curled up on the floor where my feet would be and is door watching every few minutes. Her experience of kennels hasn't been positive so far so I will just keep reassuring her she is stuck with me.

I think everyone at my Thursday group now thinks I'm insane for blubbing about my dog lol! Would be so much easier if we could get into their doggy brain and fathom out what they are thinking!
Back to top Go down
Staffylover
Team Member
Team Member
avatar

Female
Location : Cheshire
Number of posts : 31891

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Thu 22 Mar 2012, 10:05 pm

If you are concerned about the kennels have you thought about home boarding where she can go and stay with someone in their home? You could build up introductions leading up to your holiday and then it wont be such a change for her?

_________________

Back to top Go down
suziet
Team Support
Team Support
avatar

Female
Location : East Riding of Yorkshire
Number of posts : 23424

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Fri 23 Mar 2012, 7:48 am

Ohhhhh my beds as pups shredded their beds too xxx but thankfully they don't do it anymore xxx

Back to top Go down
K999
VIP Forum Member
VIP Forum Member
avatar

Male
Location : Penyffordd, Chester, Cheshire.
Number of posts : 1087

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Fri 23 Mar 2012, 11:02 am

Mizzie has chewed up more things than I can remember, very rarely nowadays, but in the first 6 to 12 months nothing was safe. For her it was simply a stress reliever, chewing took her mind off whatever was troubling her. Which to start with, was simply being on her own.

The biggest barrier between dog and human relationships (I find with the cases I work with anyway) is emotion. Emotions for dogs are life saving devices, for humans emotions are life enhancers.
When dogs get emotional (excited, scared, aggressive, panicky etc) their body responds accordingly releasing adrenalin, testosterone, cortisol etc which basically prepares the dog for 'flight' or 'fight'....responses which may get the dog to see another day. So dog's instantly emotions in other dogs and especially people, you simply can't hide what you are feeling, dog's notice the tinyest changes in your body language. This simply means dog's struggle to trust a person who is very emotional, especially early on in the relationship. If you are emotional you are unpredictable, dog's don't like unpredictability!
Dog's always gravitate towards the calm predictable person in the room because this is the easyest person to trust and bond with.

Of course, judging cases without meeting the people involved, the dog, the relationship and the environment it is very difficult to be accurate. But the way you write does show a lot of emotion which is a positive thing for a human relationship, but makes a human - dog relationship a little trickier.
A dog can grow very close and form a strong bond and thrieve with an emotional person but the initial period of learning about each other will take longer, simply because showing emotions means you will have a large behavioural range (very happy to very sad) and this takes longer for a dog to learn than say a very calm person with a smaller behavioural range.

When I'm working with a diffcult dog, especially human aggression cases, I bond with the dog by walking, in silence, not making any contact with the dog. After a few miles I will sit, if the dog approaches I will let it sniff me whilst still ignoring it, then walk on further. This provides the dog with the vital exercise (and the stimulation which goes with it), whilst not putting any emphasis or pressure on the dog to interact with me (a potentially dangerous prospect in the dogs eyes). Now the dog knows I'm good to be around as I can provide the relaxing, stress free walks. I can be trusted because I'm always calm and relaxed during these walks. This makes me predicatable, positive and somebody a dog would be drawn to. Now on these strong foundations of trust I can start to build in affection and start to guide the dog though it's problems.

Back to top Go down
suziet
Team Support
Team Support
avatar

Female
Location : East Riding of Yorkshire
Number of posts : 23424

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Fri 23 Mar 2012, 6:46 pm

:WOOT: I just love reading your advice Adam - always learn something new xx
Back to top Go down
xXxEricaxXx
Gold Forum Member
Gold Forum Member
avatar

Female
Location : London
Number of posts : 672

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Fri 23 Mar 2012, 7:35 pm

Yeah Adams advice is amazing always. Reading what you said Adam, I think I may be the main cause for their behavirioual changes as I'm a VERY emotional person.

As for rosy, you're doing a great job and looking into it too much I think! Although I don't know full story etc my two have ripped up their beds before, always the big pillows with the stuffing. My two rarely chew anything I just think maybe those beds are fun for them to chew lol
As for letting her off, I think you should just go for it. In a safe environment though, not near any roads or anything. My two are pretty good at recall and they got even better when I changed my recall tactic. Ireland somewhere that they are having much fun offlead then we call them and usually it's to be put back on lead and their fun stops so why would they want to come back? So, I started making my recall fun. I shout on them ins high pitched fun voice, waving my arms around playfully and generally make a fool of myself haha then when they come running back to me I lavish them with praise and cuddles and scratches whilst putting their leader on them.
I think was shake said was great. Practice in garden if you have one then move onto a safe field.
Back to top Go down
xXxEricaxXx
Gold Forum Member
Gold Forum Member
avatar

Female
Location : London
Number of posts : 672

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Fri 23 Mar 2012, 7:36 pm

Ireland is supposed to say I read. Damn auto correct lol
Back to top Go down
xXxEricaxXx
Gold Forum Member
Gold Forum Member
avatar

Female
Location : London
Number of posts : 672

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Fri 23 Mar 2012, 7:37 pm

Also, last line ' I think was shake said,' is supposed to be ' I think what suzie said,'
Back to top Go down
Namadaja
Addicted Member
Addicted Member
avatar

Female
Location : Wiltshire
Number of posts : 118

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Fri 23 Mar 2012, 8:44 pm

Thank you Adam, see I don't need to get into her head....I just need you to come and live here and translate for her!

Well, Rosy had a good night and she seems a bit sorry now that she just has her 2 fleeces to sleep on!!! She keeps looking at me as if to say 'crap, I really didn't think this through'. She has been like my shadow today and just putting my shoes on is enough for her to start shaking, she is really unhappy when we get ready to go out. I have stayed firm and just gone about business as usual, including leaving her for short periods and going out. So far so good, have just come home to a very very happy to see me pooch. We went out for a good walk earlier and I am about to go out again. Tomorrow I am hoping to go out really early and see if I can let her off, even if its for a short while. Must buy some hot dog sausages!
Back to top Go down
K999
VIP Forum Member
VIP Forum Member
avatar

Male
Location : Penyffordd, Chester, Cheshire.
Number of posts : 1087

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Fri 23 Mar 2012, 9:08 pm

you'll get there Michelle, it's a lerning curve for you and Rosy!
She's watching and studying you and your behaviour just as much as you do hers!

just a quick one, don't worry about the shaking thing before walks. My Mizzie does and she's generally super calm and relaxed. She'll sit by the door waiting for her morning walk shivering and shaking. Shaking is usually a sign the dog is working through a mental challange and fighting to keep their emotions (usually excitement or fear) in check. So although it looks bad it's often a good sign, just keep relaxed yourself, set the example, and go for a nice walk.
Back to top Go down
Namadaja
Addicted Member
Addicted Member
avatar

Female
Location : Wiltshire
Number of posts : 118

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Fri 23 Mar 2012, 9:42 pm

Oh yeah she is fine when going out for her walks, she doesnt tend to shake then (she did when we first had her, dont think she had many walks before) but since yesterdays 'bedgate' every time I put my shoes or coat on or pick up my bag she starts the shaking. When she goes into her crate and its confirmed that she is staying home shes like a jelly. I have just kept my leaving the house routine the same and if we come back to shreds then we do lol.

So, just wondering, since yesterday she is laying in a ball next to my feet if I'm home, or hubby if I am out, what is she telling me/us? I was thinking its reassurance, that we are here, as she has been like my shadow today and when I come home she is soooo much more happy to see me than before bedgate lol.

I've just got a book about bonding with your dog for my kindle so going to have a read and see if any of it makes sense. If its kooky then I will just ignore it lol. Do you have a favourite dog book?
Back to top Go down
Staffylover
Team Member
Team Member
avatar

Female
Location : Cheshire
Number of posts : 31891

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Fri 23 Mar 2012, 10:28 pm

I dont tend to read books for advice if I am being honest. I think a lot depends on your dog and I dont find books cater for specifics and a lot of advice is based on the authors beliefs and not usually based on statistical facts.

for general day to day care etc I think they are OK

I prefer to speak to people who have had similar experiences with their dogs and how they have worked through things which is why I love the forum.

_________________

Back to top Go down
xXxEricaxXx
Gold Forum Member
Gold Forum Member
avatar

Female
Location : London
Number of posts : 672

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Fri 23 Mar 2012, 11:20 pm

Good luck!
Back to top Go down
K999
VIP Forum Member
VIP Forum Member
avatar

Male
Location : Penyffordd, Chester, Cheshire.
Number of posts : 1087

PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   Sat 24 Mar 2012, 7:29 am

I tend to read technical books on psychology and behaviour now-a-days, I've always been interested in the biological aspect of behaviour.

I've read many books on dogs and most of the are ok, not many really stand out for me, but here is a list of ones I usually recommend....
http://www.k999.biz/booklist.htm

Back to top Go down
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: Bonding and trust   

Back to top Go down
 
Bonding and trust
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 1 of 2Go to page : 1, 2  Next
 Similar topics
-
» Respect or trust in a relationship?
» The Cinnamon Trust
» New HH Video - Bonding rabbits - Brian and Mindy's wedding!
» Bumblebee Conservation Trust
» 2 male rabbit bonding

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Staffiezone :: Dog Chat, Help and Advice :: General or Random Staffie, Bullie and Dog Chat-
Jump to: