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 how much more can 1 owner take!

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Angel
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 1:51 pm

i agree whole heartldy with a halti hun always have i was taught to fit them by rodger mugford himself i use them on all dogs i have i refuse to walk a dog of a collar at all suki walks fab of a halti and she comes runing with me with it on too shes had it form 5 mths pre that i had a harness but as she got bigger it didnt work well so the hati was then used

i used to walk 6 dogs from home to the yard and to wrk form there all had them they make in the right hands for a very easy to walk dog i have trained many on to them and fitted hundreds when at the pet shop i personally recomend them all the time:))

and although it may not make me popular i also totally agree with you in that you cannot live with him like that he is essentally unpredicable which might settle yes BUT it might not and i am of the opioion that a true animal lover will ook not only at their own feelings but that off the animal to sometimes what appears to be the hardest choice to human is actually the best one they can make for the animal (call me hard but i,ve had to be so ) so i know how you feel and belive me its making that decision thats the worst


could you guarentee him a home with someone for life ??? could you trust him never to bite ??? could you feel happy passing him on hoping that he,ll be fine but knowing he could one day hurt someone or something ??? they are the big picture you need to look at hun if i was where you are now i know what i would do personally not for my sake but for the dogs welfare to i have been there to often at work i have had to look at the big picture and i ,ve had to do it with 2 of my own dogs (one i had no choice over at the final hurdle )defending his home or not he went aggressivly for a child i for one would never slate you for it its been bought on by his first owner not you your trying so hard to change him but there comes a time when enough is enough there has to be in some cases
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kirstie
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 2:07 pm

thats exactly what i am looking at the bigger picture and i defo wouldnt feel good about passing the problem on as i feel that any previous owner still has a responsibility to the pet theyve passed on. i still have a great deal to do with brok's owners n him as i feel that as he came from us we have a duty to help in his welfare etc. i use a halti with our rocky n he walks perfect he doesnt really need it now but i put it on as hes comfy with it. tyne however fights it all the time he hasnt got it that wen u pull it tightens he just thinks im gunna pull anyway. i love the dog 2 pieces but gunna really have to think hard about it i know i'll be unpopular for saying this but i think the vets is a high probability as i just cannot have that kind of behaviour, ive tried and tried and i dont know if i have any more in me to try again. im going to take him to the classes but im not very hopeful for him. there has 2 b a reason why hes snacking all i can think is its demi but rocky doesnt go like that and never has if anything he gets cheekier and buggs the hell outa ya when shes about ready to line. the thing is i feel its our fault some how as hes such a young dog but then i think how can it be when the others havent turned like him n they have the same rules to live by. my heads a mess and untill i sort that out i wouldnt trust any decision i made. like u say angel the signs r there i think hes a danger ready to blast off and just needs enough rope and will hang himself as the term goes and i certainly dont want that if he has 2 go id rather it was on better terms than him doing the worst thing ever, id never forgive myself
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Jo n Buffs
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 3:01 pm

some dogs do change when they are put to and tyne knows the smell of demi .if rocky has never been put to maybe this is why he is different
you will not be unpopular hun you have to do what is best for you and kinder to the dog at the end of the day it is none of us that are facing the posibilty that he could bite someone and its not us that have to take the prosecution its you .
you are nat making a rash decision you have tried and tried and still trying its not as if thats it end of your giving him that chance at the classes unfortunatley as jackie says some dogs just cannot be helped and as saad as that is i think id prefer not totake the risk
rehoming is only an option if you can find someone who understands the breed and has 100% time for tyne someone with the time and the understanding and experience could turn him round
dont punish yourself hun for what ever you decide at the end of the day you have tried every possible route and having a dog pts is not an easy decision to make
as dee and mattie has said though having him done may make a huge difference with him its if you can afford to have him done and take the chance if it works or not
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kirstie
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 3:48 pm

i really dont think that castration would make alot of difference yes the testosterone wont be there but i dont know if im right here or not but hes used to the aggression if you know what i mean i think it will still be there after surgery. i really think that after yesterday that he really is capable of biting some one yes i could muzzel him in public but i cant muzzel him perminently when in the house that just wouldnt be fair to him. if you mean put to as in being mated jo then yes rocky has been and he doesnt go on like this or show anything out of character im just at a loss i luv him 2 bits but is that enough to carry on im not so sure. ive booked an appointment at the vets as they didnt have the time for a discussion over the phone. the class teacher i will be seeing is also a behaviourist so im going to ring her aswell as she may not want to risk him in class. im hoping that she will let him as i need to try something before i give in. the thing with tyne is is that hes like jekel n hyde lovely and a pleasure to have 1 min then the opposite with no warning half the time. when people come hes usually in his cage and let out once hes calm but im scared to let him out now
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Angel
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 3:53 pm

hun read back what you,ve written and look at it from the outside looking in i think tbh you have answered your own fears j
ekyll and hyde dogs are not to be trusted castration might calm him but if his mind is now set to this one or other then it wont have any affect at all as you said in other post he is a time bomb waiting to go off and yes he is capable of biting its really only a matter of time really she what the trainer says and the vet all though i think i know what the vet would say you cant live like that and its not fair on him either having to be either muzzled or shut away its no life for either of you is it really x
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Eddi and Daisy
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 3:59 pm

To give him to someone else is also not a great idea if he is prone to bite or turning into a dog that bites it would not be fair for anyone else to have the problem what if he bit someone else while out with them.

It's so difficult to know what to do but you have to make a decision for him, if he is tormented for whatever reason and is snapping and being nasty there might be something underlying that is not medical.
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Jo n Buffs
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 4:08 pm

kirstie juts remember hun what ever happens your not going to be judged and staffiezone will allways welcome you and doglets
and if any member does want to read and have a go then it will be and sandi that they answer to ,
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kirstie
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 4:36 pm

thankyou everybody ive never had a decision like this to make only through ill health we've had to. we've had resue dogs b4 so i knew we'd have alot of work to do with him to settle him in etc... but nothing like this in my wildest dreams did i think hed b like this especially coming from a family home aswell. surely after 8/9month he should be settled in and in a routine like the others. my heads sayin 1 thing but the heart is sayin another. i keep telling myself that ive got plenty time to make a decision and not to rush into anything so im going to see what the vet suggests and linda the trainer and go from there.
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Jo n Buffs
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 5:00 pm

you will sort it hun see what they have to say then if you still feel the same then you have no choice to be honest and you cant be ruled by your heart hun we know you love him and as daft as it seems all of us here i bet are feeling for you i no i am xxx
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Eddi and Daisy
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 5:23 pm

Me too let anyone criticize you for this then you will see the other side to me, you have gone above and beyond with him and nothing has worked thats why I think it could be something else, as in something psyhcological.
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Angel
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 6:00 pm

me to hun been there done that i,m firmly on your side what ever you have to do they can answer to me as well fingers crossed the vet and linda can help but if not then you know you have done everything you possibly can if its physcological issue then nothing will help but you,ve tried xx
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kirstie
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 6:16 pm

ive tried gettin in touch with his other owners but they are either ignoring my calls and texts or just not interested. i wanted to discuss how he is being and try and get some honesty out of them to see if i could find anything out. ive even mailed them and nothing. if id have passed him on in different circumstances id be happy to help anything to help them and the dog as we may not have had him anymore but we'd still love him and want the best for him. i guess not everybody are the same. i must admit today hes been great but we havent had any visitors or anything, im not going to let that change anything untill ive seeked professional advice as i know as soon as the ' peace is shattered' things will be back again. at the min im feeling confused as to whether it is something we have done with him, we dont drink so nothing could have happened to him whilst drunk, he gets exercise, we keep him active with play time, hes fed watered etc, and surely the change of setting will be out of his system by now. he has everything he could possibly need or want he is disciplined like the others i cant see where ive gone wrong if it is me then really wouldnt the others be like it? i could go on n on but i know its not helping any. ive rang linda and she said to bring him to classes and see how he is and at the end we'l have a chat about options. i could just cry lol but im going to have 2 b strong but i really feel im fighting a loosing battle here.
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Eddi and Daisy
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 6:33 pm

Honey it is nothing you have done omg some people would not do half of what you have, you have done everything for him.

It's so hard knowing that there might only be one option for him but as I've said if it is a pyshcological issue then he is feeling very frightened too maybe.

Try and be as strong as you can we are all here supporting you if you need to chat I can pm you my telephone number even if it's just to have a rant, I am very good at listening.

You both are in my thoughts and prayers hun.
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kirstie
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 6:41 pm

thanks huni lets hope i get some positive news and advice that will give him lee way at the min hes lying in the dog bed looking like butter wouldnt melt and looks so peaceful lol. hes going for his walk in a bit i may try exercising him more then 3 times a day mayb its 2 much energy its worth a try anything is worth a try. tell u im a glutten for punishment lol my dad always said i never know when to call it a day lol
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Angel
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 7:47 pm

dont suppose you have room for a treadmill do you? that could maybe help in tiring him out more its a trick used with dogs like him and it works just a thought :))
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Jo n Buffs
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 8:02 pm

thats a good idea dee a lot of people i speak to you use them i been after one for ages for buffy
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kirstie
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Wed 03 Mar 2010, 8:09 pm

i dont unfortunatley so i guess its just more walking and walking and walking for me lol on the plus side of it i'll get fit lol xx
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Mattie
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Thu 04 Mar 2010, 9:50 am

Sorry not been on line much, this week has been a nightmare because the drive and patio has been done and had to keep the dogs on a lead to toilet.

Kirsty if I didn't think you were trying I wouldn't bother giving you a kick up the backside, you have worked hard and doing a good job. I have had plenty of kicks up the backside in the past so know what they are like. I don't attack people, I will attack posts. When dealing with dogs and children we have to learn to control ourselves as you have already found out, this is easier with children than it is with dogs but learn it we can and do which is what you are now going through.

I am happy to help as much as I can, if you want we can talk on the phone, that can often solve many problems a lot better than writing as we can't see each other's body language or hear our voices which tells a lot about us.

As I said previously, it isn't mistakes that matter but how we handle them, after the incident you were thinking negative, rehome or pts, after getting a kick up the backside you are now thinking positive

I have seen so many times in the past people in similar positions were others have pussy footed about being nice, this didn't help the dog, it just made the owner feel better, sorry but I am for the dog, they can't speak for themselves These owners continued in the same way with their dog so no progress was made and the dog suffered. As you have probably noticed, I don't pussyfoot around. group hug
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kirstie
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Thu 04 Mar 2010, 12:33 pm

mattie honestly its the best way but i guess the way i was feeling etc anything would av got the same reaction from me. i cant get to the vets untill monday but i go to classes with tyne tomorrow so fingers crossed. he hada go at my brother the other day aswell and he know him. partly my fault and my brothers but also surely the dog shouldnt be doing this when he knows him. a stranger fair enough id understand that in a way. im trying so hard but at the min im feeling is it enough only time will tell i guess. im going to exercise him more maybe go for 3/4 long walks a day instead of 2/3 and then the play time with balls etc in the house. i am hoping that he can change as we have seen so many different changes in him but its the unpredictableness in him thats got me worried and i dont know where its came from as we have the same rules and routine with him as we do the others and they arent like that, the only thing i think is a cause or part of it is demi being in heat as shes locked away from him and she must be near the time for mating as hes whinging all the time and very unsettled. i guess ive just got to get over this and put it down to experience a 1 that isnt a nice 1 but never the less a one that has been learned the hard way. im hopeful that we can work with him with results as underneath it all he is a lovely loving dog headstrong fair enough but thats the male staffy for ya.
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Mattie
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Thu 04 Mar 2010, 1:01 pm

Kirsty I would just concentrate on managing him at the moment, with a bitch in season in the same house he will be like this, he is just being a normal male. ROFL

If you want to talk on the phone I can let you have my telephone number.
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kirstie
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Thu 04 Mar 2010, 7:28 pm

im hoping that i can manage him, im trying my best to remove any temptation if you know what i mean. ive just gotta concentrate on 1 thing at a time i guess rather than walking b4 i can crawl.
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Mattie
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Thu 04 Mar 2010, 8:51 pm

Watcha mean, hoping to manage him, you are going to manage him while you train him so you won't need to manage him

What I do when I get a dog with lots of problems I work outwhich problems I really need to sort first, put them in order of importance and manage the rest until I can get to them. Often I find that the managed problems have gone by the time I can get to them because dogs also learn when we manage then. It gives them stability and teaches them what is expected of them.

When you feel like screaming, smile, it will soften your body language, it will help you and him. Not easy to do but well worth the effort. Don't forget to keep plenty of wine in for when you need to chill.
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Allison
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Thu 04 Mar 2010, 9:00 pm

Oh I will agree with the wine bit lol

Stay with it hun you have had some great advice :)
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kirstie
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Thu 04 Mar 2010, 9:25 pm

think i'll need a share in the wine factory at this rate ohh and rehab by the time im through lol !! to be honest i think the agression is the most important item on the agenda but how do i start? glad i have people to help gunna ask linda 2morra and hopefully be able to get a routine started and get back on track again!!!!! i must admit hes been really gud the last cuple of days but we've had no visitors and ive had him 4 his walks and also had time out from him when i walked our rocky 2 so i think it helped me sort my head out. the last thing i want is to give up and have him destroyed as i luv him 2 bitz but i really am feeling like this is the last chance hes got ive tried loads and am really gunna try even harder with him now
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Angel
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PostSubject: Re: how much more can 1 owner take!   Thu 04 Mar 2010, 10:04 pm

ok another thought here

hilton herbs make horse herb mixes
but they also make doggie ones too
and in that range they do a mix called calmer wel was called that unless they have changed it now i can vouch for hilton herbs big time they work i even convinced my non herb liking vet that herbs work (long story involving my mare a torn tendon and me refusing to bute her up and stable her lol ) it may be worth trying them they do work and it may help chill him out and feel generally happier if you google hilton herbs you should find all the info on there they may even have a better version by now but they do work 100%
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